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> The Forsaken - Teaser1, :-D
VaudeVillian
post Mar 30 2007, 04:51 PM
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Just a short "intro," if you will, to hint at the full storyline of The Forsaken. Basic video. But gets the point across :-) Plus it felt good to get a little video work in instead of more script writing lol.
Anywho, enjoy the short 40 second teaser-trailer.

http://www.gamingsanctum.com/productions/f....php?id=teaser1


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VaudeVillian
post Mar 30 2007, 06:33 PM
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QUOTE (poae @ Mar 30 2007, 06:16 PM) *
I'm a writer. Excuse me while I have an opinion for once! omgz.

Anyways. I understand what you are trying to come across with your words, but pieces of it are taking away from the dramatic effect you are trying to produce.

You say, "What if your whole life... all of your history." I would remove "all of" and leave it as "What if your whole life... your history..." It is the same point just the words are more bold and striking without repetitiveness. I would do the same thing with "How can we not all" by removing the word 'all' and make it read, "How can we not" we already states a plural form.

For some reason I personally don't like how it reads at the end. It's just not giving me the catchy ending. I know you are wanting to pull at feelings and bring a person to really want to know. I suppose I would have gone with something like, "In a world already consumed by war... how can we not be The Forsaken." Though I could be ignorant of the history of what you are rolling this story up from. I just feel that "be a part of" is too nice like you are joining a book club or something. It needs to be more BAM POW.

;) My two cookies.

fair enough. and i appreciate the tips.
and ur completely right on the repetition. ill be updating that soon.

as for the happy book club, i tried some other approaches. but nothing really seemed to work

EDIT--
made the suggested changes.
any better?


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TheGodfather
post Mar 30 2007, 08:15 PM
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QUOTE (VaudeVillian @ Mar 31 2007, 03:33 AM) *
fair enough. and i appreciate the tips.
and ur completely right on the repetition. ill be updating that soon.

as for the happy book club, i tried some other approaches. but nothing really seemed to work

EDIT--
made the suggested changes.
any better?


Ok. Please do not take ANY of these comments the wrong way, I am only going to break this down EXACTLY how I see it as an outsider looking AT the project.

Music, for some reason the only thing I say these days to myself is, IS IT ORIGINAL? Then I ask, does it fit the genre of the piece.
What I hear here is Arabian desert music. How do the Arabs and the undead who live in Brill match up? I understand the "feeling it gives off" however if you are going for accuracy attached to the game it would not have the right feel.

Flag
I fucking love this flag shot with YOUR whole life on it. However, it should be the FIRST SHOT imo. If you are going to bam hit ya with something with meaning, use that shot it is brilliant. Or how about the end shot? Where it reveals "the Forsaken"

Your history... Ok so we are showing undercity... I think we need something more meaningful to history here, something no one has seen before. If we show the undercity here we are not bringing the player INTO the trailer making them want to see the movie we are showing them, hey remember when you logged out here? Also on the shot itself, why is there two different motions? I would understand a yaw + push in or out, however a turn while pushing in is jagged and also doesn't portray the intense moment of build and looks a bit choppy.

In a world already consumed by war
I see two people fighting. And in a battleground too. A closed environment. Show a raid on southshore :) Show some undead!

How can we not... Same goes for this why Orgrimarr? what does it have to do with the Forsaken? In hindsight the Forsaken are just friendly with the orcs cause they have no reason to kill them yet.

The popped text in that shot to the bottom of the scene, to pop text you want to make sure there is something to draw your eye to the text happening on screen. Right now the scene is stagnant.

All text on black backgrounds Right now there is no reason to jump to black. The scenes are not edgy enough to say HEY we TOTALLY need a black background to give the watcher a break on the eyes or a moment to revel in what they saw.

From what i watched I think I either saw an advertisement for horde cities, or perhaps the beginning of a pvp movie that uses story to try to make it look cooler.

From the flag shot I can see you have a good eye, you just need to make sure shots have meaning, emotion, and reason. Do not count on a song's emotion to carry your piece however important sound can effect a piece. Also why make a trailer? Is it to make a "movie" or to show into the heart of a movie to make people YEARN for that piece? As much as I was not a HUGE fan of 300, watch their trailers, it was an orgasm of shit that made you say OMG I MUST SEE THIS.

Go to apple.com/trailers and check out some of their stuff. Yes you don't have a million dollar budget or famous actors, but you have the ability to expound of ideas you may see and spark new ones! Plus there is always a bit of craft and fundamental that helps in a movies base.

Hope that helped and i was not too harsh, but I figure you are here cause you know we don't pussy foot around the point and go, OMG BEST THING I HAVE EVA SEEN!!! 1111ONE ONE!!! We are all here to grow :)

P.S. Whoever said you ONLY NEEDED ONE SHOT per text line? :) And why not break it up into Shot shot text shot text black text shot shot shot text TITLE! give it a rhythm to increase the forward motion!
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VaudeVillian
post Mar 31 2007, 02:29 AM
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QUOTE (Tristan @ Mar 30 2007, 08:15 PM) *
Ok. Please do not take ANY of these comments the wrong way, I am only going to break this down EXACTLY how I see it as an outsider looking AT the project.

Music, for some reason the only thing I say these days to myself is, IS IT ORIGINAL? Then I ask, does it fit the genre of the piece.
What I hear here is Arabian desert music. How do the Arabs and the undead who live in Brill match up? I understand the "feeling it gives off" however if you are going for accuracy attached to the game it would not have the right feel.

Flag
I fucking love this flag shot with YOUR whole life on it. However, it should be the FIRST SHOT imo. If you are going to bam hit ya with something with meaning, use that shot it is brilliant. Or how about the end shot? Where it reveals "the Forsaken"

Your history... Ok so we are showing undercity... I think we need something more meaningful to history here, something no one has seen before. If we show the undercity here we are not bringing the player INTO the trailer making them want to see the movie we are showing them, hey remember when you logged out here? Also on the shot itself, why is there two different motions? I would understand a yaw + push in or out, however a turn while pushing in is jagged and also doesn't portray the intense moment of build and looks a bit choppy.

In a world already consumed by war
I see two people fighting. And in a battleground too. A closed environment. Show a raid on southshore :) Show some undead!

How can we not... Same goes for this why Orgrimarr? what does it have to do with the Forsaken? In hindsight the Forsaken are just friendly with the orcs cause they have no reason to kill them yet.

The popped text in that shot to the bottom of the scene, to pop text you want to make sure there is something to draw your eye to the text happening on screen. Right now the scene is stagnant.

All text on black backgrounds Right now there is no reason to jump to black. The scenes are not edgy enough to say HEY we TOTALLY need a black background to give the watcher a break on the eyes or a moment to revel in what they saw.

From what i watched I think I either saw an advertisement for horde cities, or perhaps the beginning of a pvp movie that uses story to try to make it look cooler.

From the flag shot I can see you have a good eye, you just need to make sure shots have meaning, emotion, and reason. Do not count on a song's emotion to carry your piece however important sound can effect a piece. Also why make a trailer? Is it to make a "movie" or to show into the heart of a movie to make people YEARN for that piece? As much as I was not a HUGE fan of 300, watch their trailers, it was an orgasm of shit that made you say OMG I MUST SEE THIS.

Go to apple.com/trailers and check out some of their stuff. Yes you don't have a million dollar budget or famous actors, but you have the ability to expound of ideas you may see and spark new ones! Plus there is always a bit of craft and fundamental that helps in a movies base.

Hope that helped and i was not too harsh, but I figure you are here cause you know we don't pussy foot around the point and go, OMG BEST THING I HAVE EVA SEEN!!! 1111ONE ONE!!! We are all here to grow :)

P.S. Whoever said you ONLY NEEDED ONE SHOT per text line? :) And why not break it up into Shot shot text shot text black text shot shot shot text TITLE! give it a rhythm to increase the forward motion!

no offense taken at all. the reason i post here..is to improve, which i have a lot of room to do so.
i really appreciate all the criticism as harsh as it may be lol.

And to clearify, let me break down the basic background behind my scripting.
it follows warcraft lore...somewhat.... but it is also a created scenario not documented within wow.

QUOTE ("gamingsanctum.com")
When a world is consumed by opposing factions, who can keep order? Who can keep balance?

Before the first wars, even before the scourge came to be, The TRUE Forsaken were keeping balance between the Orcs and the Humans. The name was later adopted by the Undead freed from the Lich King's hold, due to their similarities in fate.

The True Forsaken were taken from their lives, forced to perform tasks they wouldn't wish upon their worst enemies.
Leaving one life, only to live another, for the greater good of the world. No longer serving their race, they now serve outkasts and fight for balance.


hope that gives a decent outlook on the true story im getting at. not the undead armies, but any man/woman/child who is taken from one life, to live another, rather through death...or choice.


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TheGodfather
post Mar 31 2007, 02:40 AM
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QUOTE (VaudeVillian @ Mar 31 2007, 11:29 AM) *
no offense taken at all. the reason i post here..is to improve, which i have a lot of room to do so.
i really appreciate all the criticism as harsh as it may be lol.

And to clearify, let me break down the basic background behind my scripting.
it follows warcraft lore...somewhat.... but it is also a created scenario not documented within wow.
hope that gives a decent outlook on the true story im getting at. not the undead armies, but any man/woman/child who is taken from one life, to live another, rather through death...or choice.


I can definitely read it, now to portray it in a "trailer" non the less a MOVIE is another thing :) I think a lot of people have a misconception that a trailer is easier than a movie.. when actually a trailer is a harder feat. at times than a movie with a full story.
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VaudeVillian
post Mar 31 2007, 02:50 AM
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QUOTE (Tristan @ Mar 31 2007, 02:40 AM) *
I can definitely read it, now to portray it in a "trailer" non the less a MOVIE is another thing :) I think a lot of people have a misconception that a trailer is easier than a movie.. when actually a trailer is a harder feat. at times than a movie with a full story.

mkay, i will try to recreate this, and hopefully continue to get some more criticism as needed :-)
i find it's the best way to learn.:-D


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Makesfolkslose
post Mar 31 2007, 04:47 AM
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I personally like the music. Regardless of whether or not it fits the "forsaken" theme, I think it fits the theme of the trailer and hopefully the theme of the movie. I agree with Tristan that while there are some cool shots in there (like the flag shot), some of the others have little meaning. The PvP shot is mainly what deterred me. You said "war" and it was just two people whacking eachother. Anyways, I thought it was pretty cool.


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JohnnyTrio
post Mar 31 2007, 08:46 PM
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I put together a little re-edit I'd like to share, but I'm wondering if anyone is able to provide some temp ftp space for storage / viewage.

Lemme know, eh?


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Darjk
post Mar 31 2007, 09:05 PM
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I'm able to Johnny if you need, just hit me up on GTalk or something.


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VaudeVillian
post Mar 31 2007, 10:45 PM
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...
:-)


mssg me.
ill setup an ftp on gamingsanctum.com for ya


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Romily
post Mar 31 2007, 11:45 PM
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Neat trailer! What did you use to make it (software/hardware)?

Only thing that really got to me was the panning during the PvP scene. I know once it's shot, that's often what you have but.. If there's a way to include a smoother shot or reshoot for a smoother, more circular motion that would help a lot.

Looking forward to more. ;)


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VaudeVillian
post Apr 1 2007, 12:08 AM
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QUOTE (Romily @ Mar 31 2007, 11:45 PM) *
Neat trailer! What did you use to make it (software/hardware)?

Only thing that really got to me was the panning during the PvP scene. I know once it's shot, that's often what you have but.. If there's a way to include a smoother shot or reshoot for a smoother, more circular motion that would help a lot.

Looking forward to more. ;)

Fraps and Priemere 7.0
:-)

thanks


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JohnnyTrio
post Apr 1 2007, 12:23 PM
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Just wanted to provide additional feedback.

I want to start off saying that I felt the energy was there, but I feel the trailer didn't quite fire on all cylinders.

I'll be the first to agree with Tristan about original music - right now, we're able to use Blizzard's Intellectual Property by the skin of our teeth. When you add on the additional layers of further copyright infringement, things can get downright "cease and desist".

I'm only of this mindset due to the fact that I produce content for a living and I need to be especially sensitive to these types of things - your average viewer could care less.

On the flip side, I really did like the tone of the music.

So, in my opinion, this trailer could benefit from an original score, with the current music going to the composer for the mood and feel that you're trying to convey.

Moving on, I'm glad that you made a decision to stick with titles and no voice over and stuck with it.

When working with video and text, I find it especially challenging to balance the many factors that text brings to a composition.

As a filmmaker, it's up to you to let the viewer know what they need to look at. By using motion, color, and contrast, you're able to channel the viewer's eye exactly where you want it to go.

Text is a perfect compliment to wide, general shots, where a viewer can take in the whole picture in a minimal amount of time, comprehend it, and move on to the text and file that away before the next shot.

I think your pairing text with the undead flag (sweet shot, btw) was a great combo. There was slow movement and the text was placed to compliment the shot.

On the other hand, the frantic battle scene with camera movement AND character movement WITH bright colors accenting the fighting, also had text at the very bottom of the screen.

I feel that, in a situation like this, there's just too much going on for a viewer to understand it all. Although there are times that a storyteller wants to overwhelm an audience, there's some very creative ways to do so.

This also prompts me to take a moment and talk about my opinion of how to use text in video.

In this case, as in many, the text in your trailer becomes a character of sorts.

Depending on the font you use, you can get a totally different emotional reaction.

Imagine the phrase "Honey, I'm home."

Now imagine it in that Curlz font. Pretty cute, eh? (looks like Poae's sig... lol)

What would it do to the mood if it was a font that looked like fresh blood? We get pretty creepy, pretty quick.

All in all, I think we get excited about our work and want to show it off - I think this was just a case where things clicked for you and you wanted to share it with us because you see it for what it's going to be.

I feel like I know where you're going, and I can't wait to see a darker look into the realm of the Undead.

I've done a quick re-edit of the trailer to show what just a change in the text and presentation can do to the entire mood.

I had to grab a few new shots too - the text was overlayed in some shots...

Anyway - it's a rush job, but I really wanted to emphasize the impact typography can have on a project. (and there's a punctuation error... but I was excited and I wanted to show everyone... :whistling: )

Check it out here


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VaudeVillian
post Apr 1 2007, 01:41 PM
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REALLY appreciate the tips and hints!
cant wait to give this another go. hopefully this goes well :-)

p.s.
i like your version. nicely done.


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Dead Workers Par...
post Apr 1 2007, 02:11 PM
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Your getting some great advice here! My first impression was that there was a modern twist to this movie. The element that lead me to believe this is the hi-tech font that was used. As I watched the whole thing, I thought maybe the font was not the best choice as it didn't lead up to anything explaining why such a modern looking font was used.

I agree with most of what others have said about the story not really revealing itself with what is presented. I also really wanted to see something new that I don't get to see when playing the game. The flag scene is a good example of seeing something fresh. I totally love the sun going down in the shot by VaudeVillian, and the undead hand rising from the grave. I think a movie or trailer should get us excited, excite our senses a bit. Another cool thing to try is to color correct your footage, give us something that is over the top, something that we can show our friends and get pumped about.

I do like the music, and if you haven't noticed, I love that style of music. I've used that style in both our trailers and in the tutorial series. It may not fit exactly to the lore, but it's a personal taste I suppose.


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StoneFalconProdu...
post Apr 1 2007, 03:48 PM
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QUOTE (JohnnyTrio @ Apr 1 2007, 01:23 PM) *
Just wanted to provide additional feedback.

I want to start off saying that I felt the energy was there, but I feel the trailer didn't quite fire on all cylinders.

I'll be the first to agree with Tristan about original music - right now, we're able to use Blizzard's Intellectual Property by the skin of our teeth. When you add on the additional layers of further copyright infringement, things can get downright "cease and desist".

I'm only of this mindset due to the fact that I produce content for a living and I need to be especially sensitive to these types of things - your average viewer could care less.

On the flip side, I really did like the tone of the music.

So, in my opinion, this trailer could benefit from an original score, with the current music going to the composer for the mood and feel that you're trying to convey.

Moving on, I'm glad that you made a decision to stick with titles and no voice over and stuck with it.

When working with video and text, I find it especially challenging to balance the many factors that text brings to a composition.

As a filmmaker, it's up to you to let the viewer know what they need to look at. By using motion, color, and contrast, you're able to channel the viewer's eye exactly where you want it to go.

Text is a perfect compliment to wide, general shots, where a viewer can take in the whole picture in a minimal amount of time, comprehend it, and move on to the text and file that away before the next shot.

I think your pairing text with the undead flag (sweet shot, btw) was a great combo. There was slow movement and the text was placed to compliment the shot.

On the other hand, the frantic battle scene with camera movement AND character movement WITH bright colors accenting the fighting, also had text at the very bottom of the screen.

I feel that, in a situation like this, there's just too much going on for a viewer to understand it all. Although there are times that a storyteller wants to overwhelm an audience, there's some very creative ways to do so.

This also prompts me to take a moment and talk about my opinion of how to use text in video.

In this case, as in many, the text in your trailer becomes a character of sorts.

Depending on the font you use, you can get a totally different emotional reaction.

Imagine the phrase "Honey, I'm home."

Now imagine it in that Curlz font. Pretty cute, eh? (looks like Poae's sig... lol)

What would it do to the mood if it was a font that looked like fresh blood? We get pretty creepy, pretty quick.

All in all, I think we get excited about our work and want to show it off - I think this was just a case where things clicked for you and you wanted to share it with us because you see it for what it's going to be.

I feel like I know where you're going, and I can't wait to see a darker look into the realm of the Undead.

I've done a quick re-edit of the trailer to show what just a change in the text and presentation can do to the entire mood.

I had to grab a few new shots too - the text was overlayed in some shots...

Anyway - it's a rush job, but I really wanted to emphasize the impact typography can have on a project. (and there's a punctuation error... but I was excited and I wanted to show everyone... :whistling: )

Check it out here



That's kewl the type face thing is awesome!

That hand coming from the grave would be even radder if a. the shot was at night (moody) b. we slowly push foward through a graveyard instead of panning sideways (depth adds drama) c. the end of the push forward ends in an artificial rush foward (speed up) and slam to static shot of grave and the hand comes up (a la' the Ring) lol

=P


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JohnnyTrio
post Apr 1 2007, 04:39 PM
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QUOTE (StoneFalconProductions @ Apr 1 2007, 06:48 PM) *
That's kewl the type face thing is awesome!

That hand coming from the grave would be even radder if a. the shot was at night (moody) b. we slowly push foward through a graveyard instead of panning sideways (depth adds drama) c. the end of the push forward ends in an artificial rush foward (speed up) and slam to static shot of grave and the hand comes up (a la' the Ring) lol

=P


Quoted for truth!


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Romily
post Apr 2 2007, 01:08 AM
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QUOTE (JohnnyTrio @ Apr 1 2007, 04:23 PM) *

Very cool effect with the contrasting meaning flashing almost like lightning "Doo doo doo WAEHHH!" (/insert creepy music)!


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